My Interview originally published in the Indica Website on Nov 15, 2023 by Aparna Sridhar

 

Shri Sunil Kumar has been actively associated with Gaudiya Vaishnavism through the Hare Krishna Movement, a unit of ISKCON Bengaluru, where he has been associated with practitioners and scholars in the field. His spiritual journey has been a source of inspiration for his writing.

He is a postgraduate from the University of Westminster, London. His book, Existential Angst (1999), an anthology of poetry is catalogued in the British Council, Sussex, the U.S. South Asian Literature List. He has also authored Surreal City; a work of fiction, a poignant tale spanning multiple generations that takes readers on a journey through time and space. The noted poet Nissim Ezekiel made him a member of the P.E.N. (India Chapter).

Sunil Kumar’s paper at INDICA’s Conference on Vaishnavism held in April 2023 examines the historical, religious, and cultural significance of Vṛndāvana – one of the most sacred towns in Indian devotional tradition, particularly for Vaishnavas.

He explores the town’s complex history, tracing its evolution from ancient times to the present day, the role it has played in the development and propagation of Gaudiya Vaishnavism, and how it continues to be a major centre for spiritual practice and learning.

In this interview, he talks about the role of Gaudiya Vaishnavism in the Sri Krishna bhakti sampradaya.

How did you get interested in Gaudiya Vaishnavism and how has it inspired you in your life?

My interest in Gaudiya Vaishnavism or what can be loosely described as a synonym for Bengali Vaishnavism began in childhood. As an avid and voracious reader and a quizzer both in school and university, I was curious and inquisitive by nature. Children are naturally impressionable, and apart from Srila Prabhupada (Abhay Charan De)’s devotionally supercharged books, I would credit my maternal grandmother’s influence and the learned scholar and first governor general of India C. Rajagopalachari’s excellent and simple texts on the Ramayana and the Mahabharata for my interest in religious tradition in general and Gaudiya Vaishnavism in particular from a very young age.

I believe it has inspired in my life both on a subtle and a gross level. The imprint of Gaudiya Vaishnavism has lingered on over the years even when I was working in unrelated fields like technology and management. Over the past decade, a reconnection with the praxis and spirit of Gaudiya Vaishnavism happened with a very diligent, scholastic and extremely devoted group in Mumbai who were sent here by the Akshay Patra founder and ISKCON Bengaluru founder Madhu Pandit Das ji.

Devotional movements usually expect you to transcend intellect and surrender to the divine. I believe that is still some way off in my case. Sri Aurobindo stressed on the synthesis of yogas or the interconnectedness of all paths to the Supreme and my mind resonates with that understanding. Sri Krishna would also not have unequivocally explained all paths to the Supreme if that were not the case. Of course, ideological debates and commentaries have been extant in Bharat for a very long time, but Gaudiya Vaishnavism is a very important contributing river in the ocean of Indic thought and belief.

What according to you is the difference between Gaudiya Vaishnavism and the modern ISCKON movements?

There is an unnecessary bifurcation made between the modern ISKCON movements and Gaudiya Vaishnavism. ISKCON as envisaged by the founder acharya Bhaktivedanta Srila Prabhupada is nothing but a continuation of the sampradaya in a more modern avatar. India has always been fascinated by the West and the U.S always has been a cultural exemplar that people wanted to emulate for a long time.

In the 60s, when an impoverished 70 year old Srila Prabhupada set out to the West on a steamer with tickets gifted by Scindia steamship owner Sumati Morarji, he had a mere Rs 40 with him and his set of Srimad Bhagavatam (Bhagavata Purana) books and unbounded faith in Bhagavan Sri Krishna. He was following the instructions of his guru maharaja Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati to spread the message of Chaitanya Mahaprabhu in the Western world.

Gaudiya Vaishnavism as such is a Vaishnava tradition that started way back with the devotional genius of Chaitanya Mahaprabhu and his disciples, generally refered to as the six gosvamis of Vrindavan. It flourished in the medieval era due to the patronage of local chieftains, Rajput princes and relatively lesser persecution by Akbar.

The intellectual basis and roots for Gaudiya Vaishnavism and a majority of the acharyas were from the present-day Bengal -Odisha region. It petered out to a great extent in the 19th century and was slightly derided in the Bengali renaissance period after British colonisation. Nevertheless, the influence of Chaitanya and his devotional approach was part and parcel of the cultural substrate of Bengal. We have to consider the influence of Bhaktivinoda Thakur and his son Bhaktisiddhanta Sarawati in reviving the Gaudiya Vaishnava tradtion.

Post the death of Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati in 1936, the Gaudiya Math founded by Saraswati witnessed an internal power struggle between his disciples and a parting of ways, as well as founding of competing schools both claiming to be the heir apparent to the Gaudiya throne. Prabhupada, founder of ISKCON lived in complete obscurity as a pharmacist and after sanyasa in a small corner of a Vrindavan temple for nearly 11 years. He just remembered one instruction by his guru maharaja Saraswati to spread Chaitanya’s message of unalloyed devotion to Krishna in the Western world in a language they could understand, English.

ISKCON is the most successful offshoot of the Gaudiya tradtion that is responsible for making the movement internationally famous as well as attracting academia from around the world. Modern India was also reacquainted with an ancient tradition that would otherwise have faded away.

There is a perception that ISKCON was a hippie and a Western movement due to many of Prabhupada’s disciples in the early days being Western. This was natural as ISKCON was founded in 1965 in New York. There were a few scandals in the West in the 80s, but all the recent growth has come due to the movement expanding in the country that gave birth to the Gaudiya tradition- India.

Some differences from tradition- just like Swami Chinmaya’s initial lectures in English in Chennai, orthodox Brahmins initially resented Prabhupada for initiating mlecchas (Westerners) as disciples in a traditional Sampradaya. Some other critiques levelled at ISKCON and differences from earlier Gaudiya tradition- active proselytisation or preaching that some people in India only associate with Abrahamic religions.

In my opinion, ISKCON is merely a continuation of the Gaudiya Vaishnava tradition aimed at explaining ancient philosophy in a more contemporary, palatable form. Acharyas in ancient Bharat were pragmatic and explained that actions had to be taken as per the kala and the desha (time and country). I would credit the genius of Srila Prabhupada and his immense faith in Krishna, Chaitanya and his guru’s words for the worldwide expansion of the movement in the twilight years of his life till his death (65-77).

What role have the gurus of these movements played in creating renewed interest around Vrindavan?

Vrindavan or the Vraja region always has been a pivotal part of Sanatana belief systems. Bhagavan Sri Krishna has been worshipped from North to South, East to West. Unfortunately, due to brutal Islamic invasions over many centuries, Mathura and the Vraja region had become a desolate wasteland. Gaudiya Vaishnava tradition especially, local legends and even competing sampradayas have attributed the rediscovery of Vrindavan to Sri Chaitanya’s mystic recollections and trances around Lord Krishna’s pastimes.

Despite the affluence of the West, there was a hippie movement, loneliness, despair and a search for spirituality that they believed existed in India. Running away from soulless materialism, Indic gurus have always asserted that there is more to life than mere eating, drinking, earning money et al. The initial inflow from the West to Vrindavan was in the 60s and the 70s, apart from Bharatiya pilgrims who always visited Vrindavan as part of tradition. In 2023, we have a more materially affluent India but the global rise of dangerous extremism, mindless violence and technological dangers lurking in the background.

As always, there are two sides to the story and depending on your perspective you can see the glass as half-full or half empty. I believe there are still no dearth of spiritual wisdom latent in Indic tradition and we have merely scratched the tip of the iceberg. The gurus of this tradition (I believe your question pertains to ISKCON) are planning the tallest Hindu temple in the world – namely the Chandroday Mandir in Vrindavan. Now critics may decry this as commercialism but like most places in India, Vrindavan is witnessing a large influx of tourists and unplanned growth.

In the modern age, commerce and marketing are omnipresent but these are not restricted to merely ISKCON. The competing Gaudiya Maths have not been as successful but they are present in Vrindavan, that is the epicentre of the tradition around Sri Krishna. A disciplined daily schedule instituted by the founder acharya Prabhupada hat comprises aartis, lectures on the Bhagavad-Gita and Bhagavatam and book distribution is followed around the world and in Vrindavan.

ISKCON, initially popular in the more developed Western countries gradually spread worldwide and I have met and interacted with disciples from the former Soviet Republics- Russia, Ukraine, etc, South America, Hungary and even China.

The rise of social media has given an even bigger platform for gurus to spread their message and this has also increased interest across India as well. However, there are many myths and misconceptions around and these have to be cleared so that Sanatana tradition and Indic belief do not wane off and flourish even more. Renewed interest around Vrindavan will only contribute to the resurgence of India’s core dharmic values.

How has Vrindavan increased in importance as the hub of Vaishnavism in recent years?

I would not call Vrindavan as the only hub of Vaishnavism. It certainly is the most important place for acolytes of the Gaudiya tradtion along with the Nabadwip-Mayapur region, the birthplace of Sri Chaitanya. I had the pleasure of visiting Srirangam, Guruvayoor, Pandharpur, Dwarka and Puri over the years- all very important in Vaishnav tradition.

However the pan-Indian hub of the Vaishnava tradition around Krishna is certainly the Vraja region, Vrindavan in particular. Apart from the ancient Gosvami temples in Vrindavan, there are modern marvels like the Prem Mandir constructed by the followers of Kripalu ji Maharaj. Sadly, there is a lack of town planning and concern for the environment in modern India. Increased population, overcrowding and unclean environs take away from the charm of a devotional town. Reverence for mother earth and the environment has been replaced by indifference.

The construction of the Krishna Balram temple in Vrindavan was complete in ‘75, one of the earliest ISKCON temples, along with Juhu in Mumbai. Initially, on the outskirts of Vrindavan, it was and still is sometimes referred to as the ‘Angrez Mandir’ for a long time by locals. However, modern Vrindavan has grown by leaps and bounds and it is very much within the crowding, bustling space of the overcrowded town.

Although we certainly can’t designate a place as a hub of Vaishnavism merely by the number of people coming there, it certainly is an important parameter. Apart from that, scholarly and devotional literature have always considered Vrindavan akin to a terrestrial Vaikuntha. Surdas, Mirabai, Vallabhacharya, the only female alwar Andal, traditions of music, dance, poetry and literature have been influenced by the concept of Vrindavan for millennia.

In recent years, we have seen a resurgence of interest in youth in uncovering the wisdom of our traditions and the core meaning of shastras Apart from that, modern Indians have always been fascinated when there is interest from the globe- particularly the West in our ancient traditions and texts. These are positive factors contributing to the growth of Vrindavan. Also, if you have a government in the centre and the state of U.P. more favourably inclined and respectful of dharmic traditions and constructing more facilities for pilgrims, footfalls will increase. The Jiva Institute of Vedic studies founded by Satyanarayan Dasa Babaji has also contributed to the scholastic research around the Gaudiya Vaishnava tradition.

At the same time, there will be those who argue that a spirit of bhakti is the true barometer of a Vaishnava hub. I think in Kali Yuga, considering our present constraints, we can form our own objective assessment of a dhama.

How does the history and culture of Vrindavan recreate the sense of bhakti as espoused by our ancient texts?

According to the Gaudiya tradition, Vrindavan dhama is the most important place in the material universe to the bhaktas of Krishna. However, it is merely a reflection of Nitya Vrindavan/Goloka Vrindavan in the spiritual world, where Bhagavan Sri Krishna eternally resides with his consort Srimati Radharani, the gopas, the gopis and all his exalted devotees who have transcended material existence. You cannot gain the mercy of Krishna unless you please Radha. Srimati Radharani is the hladini shakti or the pleasure potency of Krishna. The highest existence according to the Gaudiya Vaishnava acharyas is a siddha deha (transcendental body) in Goloka Vrindavana and existence as a Manjari (part of a group of gopis associated with Radha).

In Kashmiri Shaivism we have the concept of prakasha and vimarsha, Shiva and Shakti or the Purusha and Prakriti of Sankhya tradition. Our ancient texts are a reservoir and repository of wisdom, layers of meaning and symbolism that require a sense of bhakti to really engage with them in any sort of profound level.

Unlike the jnana marga of Advaita Vedanta as explained by its most famous exponent Bhagavatpada Adi Shankaracharya, the Gaudiya Vaishnava tradition and its offshoot ISKCON maintain that ultimate moksha usually translated as salvation is not merely merging into Brahman or an impersonal effulgence, but in a rasa-filled relationship with Bhagavan Sri Krishna.

A person may ask why is Vrindavan so central compared to the other places we know Sri Krishna was present in his earthly sojourn- Dwarka, Mathura or Kurukshetra. A Gaudiya Vaishnava acolyte or the numerous bhaktas over the ages may come up with a straight answer- Lord Krishna’s childhood pastimes and the nectar of devotion associated with those simple childhood pranks and lilas in the Indic tradition. A psychologist will stress on the simplicity of the human emotional connect that is associated with the idea and image of Vrindavan- mother Yashoda and Krishna’s stories for instance.

The history of the Vraja region has always been associated with a sense of bhakti in the Sanatana mind regardless of his personal orientation or belief system. Even Abrahamic religions knew that it was the town most associated with Krishna.

The 84 kos yatra around all the ancient spots in Vraja has been ongoing since the 1500s. A Madurai Brahmin Narayan Bhatta again associated with the Gaudiya tradition authored the Vraj Bhakti Vilas, a detailed list of all the places to be visited in the Vraja region after consulting many Vedic texts as well as Puranas. This exemplifies the primacy of Vrindavan by a scholar drawing extensively from most of our ancient texts that are considered authoritative by almost all sampradayas.

The earliest mention of Sri Krishna and Radha according to historical sources is in the Satvahana ruler Hala’s Prakrit text ‘Gaha Sattasai’ from the present day Maharashtra region way back in the 1st century CE. Srimati Radharani is only mentioned in context to Sri Krishna’s Vrindavan stay. Even this may have been predated by a spirit of devotion and bhakti with its central focus around Vrindavan for centuries before that, effectively making the history and culture of Vrindavan a focal point for Indic devotional tradition for more than two thousand years at least.

Any visitor to Vrindavan can attest to the bhakti-infused spirit of the locals and the traditional greeting of ‘Radhe-Radhe’. Every street, ghat, stones, hill, sand and even trees are associated with Krishna and his devotees. Such towns focused solely on bhakti around a sole figure are rare around the world, and now even in India.

How can the modern bhakta be inspired both by simple chants as well as complex philosophical texts. By visits to modern temples as well as ancient tirthas?

According to the Gaudiya tradtion, Vrindavan is a dhama and not a mere tirtha. Although tirthas are a crossing or ford, where one can get past the stream of samsara, a dhama is a more important place where the Lord’s spiritual abode is manifested in the material world. Apart from Vrindavana, in the Gaudiya Vaishnava tradition Nabadwip-Mayapur is also very important.

The centrality of chanting the Lord’s Name is one of the most important parts of Gaudiya practise. According to the tradition, in an age characterised by the onslaught of materialism and incessant distractions, the bhakta can only transcend material existence by remembering the Lord and dedicating every activity to him in a spirit of nishkama (desireless) karma. As per Gaudiya Vaishnava belief, the simple chanting of the sixteen syllable Hare Krishna mantra is the easiest and fastest way to deliverance or moksha. The names of the Lord are non-different and an embodiment of the divine presence.

By Sunil